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Post by hornet32 on Nov 24, 2013 14:00:54 GMT -5
What was the point in this ? Sealion was just was just wishful thinking or not even that .
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Post by Sir John on Nov 24, 2013 14:08:49 GMT -5
Probably not up to about August 1940, when the Eagle Squadrons proved to Goering that his task was impossible.
SJ
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Post by hornet32 on Nov 24, 2013 16:30:24 GMT -5
The Empire didn't have it all their way the 109 was a match for the Spitfire and in many cases the German pilot had more experience and was better trained but with only 20 min. air time over target this was not good for the Luft bombers .
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Post by Swampy on Nov 24, 2013 16:38:05 GMT -5
Agreed, Tet, but the Nazis would still have to sail the English Channel, and they didn't have the shipping. Not only that, they would have had to face the Royal Navy, and, in those narrow waters, the British would have had the overwhelming advantage. Last, but perhaps not least, the British were willing to use poison gas to defeat the invaders.
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Post by hornet32 on Nov 24, 2013 17:00:42 GMT -5
Hitler never intended to invade the Empire he was looking for a negotiated peace Lord Halifax and his group were all for it then Churchill and his group took over Churchill knew the odds were in his favor for a Air War plus he had a very valuable ally in FDR .
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Post by Sir John on Nov 24, 2013 17:06:20 GMT -5
.....who turned up at the end of round 14!
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Post by Swampy on Nov 24, 2013 17:40:59 GMT -5
FDR didn't turn up at the end of the war; when Hitler declared war on the US on December 11/12, 1941, his armies were at the gates of Moscow, and the Japanese were triumphant everywhere.
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Post by Sir John on Nov 29, 2013 0:11:29 GMT -5
"Hitler never intended to invade the Empire he was looking for a negotiated peace Lord Halifax"
If SeaLion was just a ploy, then why did Hitler totally disrupt the European river freight system with the allocation of 3000 barges, powered and unpowered, to the french invasion ports? Then watch many of them destroyed by the RAF.
Why did he strip all the possible maritime personnel from Germany to crew those barges? Why did he even fight the Battle of Britain?
SJ
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Post by hornet32 on Nov 29, 2013 9:10:42 GMT -5
Hitler had any number of Generals who were opposed to a two front war , Hitler was not yet the dictator he later came to be and he needed his Generals so he took a half hearted flyer on Sealion so he could concentrate on Barbarossa .
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Post by Swampy on Nov 29, 2013 10:18:01 GMT -5
If SeaLion was just a ploy, then why did Hitler totally disrupt the European river freight system with the allocation of 3000 barges, powered and unpowered, to the french invasion ports? Then watch many of them destroyed by the RAF. Why did he strip all the possible maritime personnel from Germany to crew those barges? Why did he even fight the Battle of Britain? SJ I don't think Hitler meant Sealion as a ploy, but he was half-hearted about it, because he wanted to concentrate on Russia. |
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Post by Sir John on Dec 4, 2013 14:29:45 GMT -5
Not even sure any of it was "half hearted". The Luftwaffe was not half hearted about its attempt to dominate the sky over Britain.
The allocation of troops in western France was not either. To me it only became half hearted when it became obvious that it was going to fail.
Anyway the 6th was waiting for him near Cambridge! Defeat was certain!
SJ
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Post by Swampy on Dec 4, 2013 18:21:56 GMT -5
Anyway the 6th was waiting for him near Cambridge! Defeat was certain! I thought it was the 9th. |
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Post by Sir John on Dec 4, 2013 19:25:24 GMT -5
No, the first (2nd AIF) Division raised in WW2 was the 6th, then 7th, 8th, etc.
The 6th went to Britain in mid 1940 for obvious reasons, (same as the 1st Canadian Division) and Hitler knew he was beaten. From there they went to North Africa and took it all off the Italians. Mr Churchill then sent the 6th to Greece and Crete, and we all know that sad story.
SJ
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Post by Swampy on Dec 4, 2013 19:27:54 GMT -5
I never understood why the Germans could land troops, take over Crete, even while the Royal Navy had the island surrounded. I mean, why not blockade Crete, pour in Commonwealth troops, and crush the enemy?
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Post by Sir John on Dec 4, 2013 19:48:50 GMT -5
I think things happened a bit too fast for that.
The Greek Campaign went from good to bad VERY quickly, as the Germans entered the conflict to help the Italians. The withdrawal to Crete was a scratch effort, and they had little time to prepare before Max Schmelling and his mates arrived. It cost the Germans severe casualties, but they prevailed eventually. Hitler never used airborne troops again in WW2.
From that point it would have been a dangerous thing if Hitler had sent in 100 U-Boats.
JMO
SJ
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