|
TOBRUK!
Feb 24, 2013 21:53:31 GMT -5
Post by Sir John on Feb 24, 2013 21:53:31 GMT -5
usacac.army.mil/cac2/CGSC/CARL/download/csipubs/9AustralianDivVsAfricaCorps_Miller.pdfAn interesting read on Rommel's efforts to take the vital port of Tobruk in Libya, Nth Africa. By Col Ward a Miller, Ft Leavenworth Kansas. IF he had been successful, Egypt would almost certainly have been taken, no victory at El Alamein, and a different war. For those who bother, it is a fascinating read. It compliments all the personal stories I have heard over a cleansing ale with vets from the battle. Discuss. SJ
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 25, 2013 18:14:13 GMT -5
Post by boxcar on Feb 25, 2013 18:14:13 GMT -5
IMO Rommel bypassed Tobruk much the same as we bypassed Japanese positions in the South Pacific. Well not quite. He did keep troops in the area to harass the Australians, whereas we just left the Japanese to die on the vine.
I see his biggest problem as one of logistics. Fighters from Malta hampered the resupply lines on the Mediterranean, plus Hitler was not allocating him all he asked for. With more fuel and ammunition he would have kept going.
During the pause, Monty was resupplied with American tanks that were more a match to the German tanks. This gave Monty the push he needed.
Comments?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 25, 2013 21:02:00 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2013 21:02:00 GMT -5
The Empire also had Monty who was an a illusion in his own mind .
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 25, 2013 21:05:30 GMT -5
Post by boxcar on Feb 25, 2013 21:05:30 GMT -5
And very similar to our MacArthur.
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 25, 2013 21:35:03 GMT -5
Post by Sir John on Feb 25, 2013 21:35:03 GMT -5
The main reason Rommel wanted Tobruk was its harbour. His land supply lines, based on ONE road only, was far too vulnerable.
And the 'Scrap Iron Flotilla' had an easier job of supply from Alexandria than Rommel would have had from Sicily or Tunisia. Tobruk could not be relied on to "whither on the vine" if bypassed, it would have been a constant threat to Rommel's supply line, from land and the air.
SJ
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 25, 2013 21:56:49 GMT -5
Post by Swampy on Feb 25, 2013 21:56:49 GMT -5
I've always wondered how Rommel could have gotten his supplies from Europe - didn't the RN control the Mediterranean?
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 25, 2013 22:02:53 GMT -5
Post by boxcar on Feb 25, 2013 22:02:53 GMT -5
Exactly. That is why the Germans contained them, vs. we let the Japanese wither on the vine. The Aussies were in position to do some damage, and they did just that in a later battle when they broke out, as against the Japanese were not allowed to be re-supplied.
My point is/was they were bypassed for the greater good of the overall battle.
SJ”The main reason Rommel wanted Tobruk was its harbour”
He had Benghazi near by. But I don’t know just how adequate that was. As far as I know his supplies were still coming from Tripoli.
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 25, 2013 22:04:30 GMT -5
Post by boxcar on Feb 25, 2013 22:04:30 GMT -5
Off and on, Swampy. That is another long story. One has to become curent on Malta.
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 25, 2013 22:04:44 GMT -5
Post by Sir John on Feb 25, 2013 22:04:44 GMT -5
Much of his stuff arrived in LOTS of Ju52s. In fact one air fleet was intercepted and about 30 were shot down by Spitfires from Malta.
The Med is a big place, and some ships obviously managed to get through. Not sure what % came via Algeria etc to the west.
SJ
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 26, 2013 12:37:17 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2013 12:37:17 GMT -5
Even at a huge disavantage Rommel gave the Empire all they could handle , imagine how it would have been if he could have got the Itialians to fight .
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 26, 2013 16:24:14 GMT -5
Post by Sir John on Feb 26, 2013 16:24:14 GMT -5
Rommel was good general, and the defenders of Tobruk were a bit lucky in that when the Australian 6th Division took it off the Italians it already had an anti-tank ditch for 50 kms around the perimeter. Every few 100 yards were extensive weapons pits surrounded by mine fields etc. All those are still clearly visible via Google Earth.
The 9th Division arrived in Tobruk only a few days before Rommel and the Africa Corps, and it was all laid out for them, 'no assembly required'. My FILs 18th Brigade of the 7th Division arrived the day after Rommel, and 2 days before the initial 'Easter Battle'.
SJ
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 27, 2013 16:30:17 GMT -5
Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2013 16:30:17 GMT -5
Am I mistaken but didn't Rommel kick the Empires arse and take Tobruk , the OZ put up a good fight and I think Rommel might have made some minor mention of them .
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 27, 2013 16:52:28 GMT -5
Post by Sir John on Feb 27, 2013 16:52:28 GMT -5
AFTER the Australians handed over the garrison, 7th Dec 1941, it became the British Army responsibility.
Rommel came back in about June 1942, and took it off them in an afternoon.
Australia was NOT amused!
SJ
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 27, 2013 16:55:12 GMT -5
Post by Sir John on Feb 27, 2013 16:55:12 GMT -5
"I think Rommel might have made some minor mention of them ."
Rommel called the 9th Australian Division, "the finest infantry Division I ever faced". From 'The Rommel papers' I believe, though I am too stingy to buy a copy.
SJ
|
|
|
TOBRUK!
Feb 27, 2013 17:34:52 GMT -5
Post by Swampy on Feb 27, 2013 17:34:52 GMT -5
The Australians in the desert apparently said that hunting tanks was fun - not so much for the Germans, but still fun for the Aussies.
|
|